Still a very long payback period, but not as long. My AS4777.2:2015 profile allows voltages up to 265v (for short periods, and shuts down on 10 minute averages above 258v). The percentage var/VA level leading is the inverter sourcing vars to the grid, whereas the percentage var/VA level lagging is the inverter sinking vars from the grid. I got a question about export limiter that I hope to get some answers from the community. 0000004823 00000 n
Is it the 6.66 kW, as the 1.3 overload factor of a 5kW inverter, or, is it the maximum allowed (by the manufacturer) panels generating capacity, for an inverter that is allowed by a state/territory government? Please stay on topic. Im afraid in a typical situation the inverter wont show its potential output. Put down your weapons.3. All is explained here: http://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/kw-and-kwh-what-is-the-difference/, ( 5kW per hour is a non-sensical unit unless you want to describe an acceleration of energy! Most systems have mostly N facing panels, so really only generate peak power for a few hours a day (often 10am>2pm approx) I was lucky to have an early approval, so limited to 10Kw (or due to bad calculation by the approver, 8.6Kw, where he said ALL the Neutral current went down the common Neutral wire, where in fact only the difference between the phases goes down the Neutral (2 phase, 180 degree). There are two options: 1. Have I been conned into believing I could produce up to 6.6kW myself, but in fact the maximum my inverter will ever allow through to the meter (and to my house) is only 5kW? Means that it caps the amount you can reduce your bills for power used outside of daylight hours?
Rooftop solar | CitiPower & Powercor Of more concern is occasional spikes in consumption which go past the 5kw limit. ( So the solar inverter has to have its own energy meter installed in your switchboard one that talks to the inverter to tell it when power sent into the grid reaches the export limit. Will this mean any additional system would be limited to 0kW output?? Activities part of Powercors Solar Hotspots program carried out over three months included upgrading infrastructure, adjusting tap settings on street-level transformers, balancing voltage levels on powerlines and various tweakery at zone substations. As such, unless the investment pays for itself within at most 5-6 years, IMHO it is not a good investment/waste of money and natural resources. So if an inverter that is export limited to 5 kilowatts is providing 8 kilowatts of power, none of it will go to waste provided the home is consuming at least 3 kilowatts at the time. 0000011077 00000 n
5kW times the number of hours is the total production over that time. The infrastructure is not sufficiently flexible to deal with this. 0000038752 00000 n
If we consider a home in Sydney where no electricity is used during the day, and all the solar panels face directly north, then the percentage of output that will be lost due to a 5 kilowatt export limit would be: So even in a worst-case situation for Sydney, an 8 kilowatt solar system that is exported limited to 5 kilowatts will only lose 4% of generation. Still, few people will want more than the 13.33 kilowatts of panel capacity single phase homes can generally install: The Bad: Homes with single-phase power on the main grid can have up to 5 kilowatts of inverter capacity but can usually get around this limit by installing an export limited solar inverter of up to 10 kilowatts. So in effect I have two safety guards in place, 1. the 5kw limiter to the grit and 2. the extra Gateway . The word first can be confusing. For example, if you are export limited, only the Envoy-S with consumption monitoring can provide this. Our Solar & Battery Calculator can give an idea of if its likely to pay: https://www.solarquotes.com.au/solar-calculator/. Plus a Tesla Powerwall 2. The power is first used to meet household consumption, with any surplus exported to the grid for other people to use. Thats a huge jump and even a smidge higher than the Powercor network wide average of 89%. Your meter is on the connection between the mains network on one side and the combination of your inverter and your loads on the other side. I have seen my panels producing over 13 kW of power when the battery is drawing 3 kW DC power and the battery, house and car 10 kW of AC power. So what goes throgh the meter, in either direction, is the difference between what you generate and what you use. They want to do it there way and it seems my request complicates things for them and I dont hear back, bar a couple. I have a 5kw solar system plus a Tesla powerwall 2 on my house . Now, such a hybrid inverter, as I previously submitted as a post, as being needed, would have the capability of providing for up to 10kW of panels generating capacity, and, of power conversion of up to 10kW, to provide for up to 5kW to provide for charging a battery system, and, the other 5kW to provide for the household load and with surplus (to the household load, out of the 5kW provision) being exported to the grid.
Tasmania: Under 1% of Tasmanians are on SWER lines, so the generous export limit should often be available.
FAQs - MASH: Community Solar I am looking at adding a second system (6.2kW) with GoodWe inverter.
PDF CitiPower Pty Ltd/ Powercor Australia Ltd An Update: I just had system installed 4 days ago in the Energex DNSP and suggest the above is perhaps not quite correct. ) Of course, if you are planning to get an electric car, that has the potential to make a huge difference to your self consumption of solar power. Up until quite recently, Powercor had been informing a large proportion of households looking to install new solar systems they will have to cop a zero export limit due to high congestion created by exports from existing systems. People have done it at fairly low cost with second hand panels and a DC pump.) I had applications rejected, and when I asked there was NO course for negotiation or discussion its the RULES is s synopsis of the responses. In contrast, most other network distributors set a strict upper limit on the size solar panel system you can install, typically 10kW for single-phase properties. Fronius Wattpilot: A Smart EV Charger With A Short Warranty, You Wont Believe How Dumb The NSW Governments New Battery Calculator Is. A man named Canute, proved that, centuries ago. If you use a pre AS4777.3:2005 the limits are probably even higher, but you loose some other features (like frequency ramping which is probably very sensible to have if you want to be a good grid citizen), and you probably are not supposed to run those unless it is a pre 2016 install. I prefer a profile that just has the voltages set to a high voltage threshold, and if I have to sacrifice V-W mode, so be it. As discussion of the topic of export limiting, is continuing, what,if any, is/are the direct effect differences to electricity grid load (as in the load on the wires, not the load as the term used for meaning demand), between a 5kW inverter, and a 10kW inverter with 5kW export limiting? If that is the case it seems counter intuitive to me as I dont know if demand will outstrip production until I actually turn the appliance (eg A/C) on and check the display. Surely the distributors capping what you can export to the grid is a bad thing? 258 I am not even sure the inverter would support that, but I fear that sadly up to 25% of the PV energy might be going to waste! I think of it like the rate at which water is flowing out of a hose. 2. Powercor's technical assessment aims for these works to enable at least 80% of new solar applications to export 5 kW. What am I missing? 0000038218 00000 n
STCs can be received for panel capacity up to one-third greater than the inverter capacity. 253 I have just had a 6.6kw system installed with a Fronius 5kw inverter and am export limited to 3kw. Its only possible to go larger with a zero export limit: https://www.powerwater.com.au/customers/power/solar-power-systems/pv-class-requirements. In most cases, if you had your envoy shut off, the micros would start and work on their own and independently of the envoy, and in fact of each other. Solar Analytics confirms in this scenario its only exporting up to the limit; 3kw. Where do I find information on reapplying for export with Powercor? To me it does not quite make sense as no system can produce 100% of its capacity meaning my existing 3.5kW will never produce full 3.5kW (on a good day, I am lucky to get 2.5kW). After a major works program involving more than 500 different network alterations and other activities across nine key regions among the most constrained parts of the network, Powercor's new solar connections export approval rate of just over 60% at the start of the year has increased to above 90%. Generally however, I can advise that Powercor intends to upgrade the network over the next 5 years, starting in January, however, the specifics of where upgrades are happening and the order has not been decided. Would the gateway signal the micro inverters to shut down one at a time, or to all reduce output equally? If so, it would make replacing the whole system more viable which is exactly what I wanted to avoid (and such a waste!). 0000037380 00000 n
Because people have been refused any STCs for being just a few watts over, no installer will go over the limit for a normal installation. Normally single phase properties can have up to 5 kilowatts of solar inverter capacity and 3 phase properties can have 15 kilowatts. When a home is exported limited, all the power the solar inverter can produce is available for the home to use. I have an existing 3.5kW PV system with Solis inverter. And, if a street full of these, plugs their cars into the grid, for recharging, starting the recharging between 1700 and 1800, lots of entertaining fireworks, along the street powerlines exploding. If you dont get under the covers and look carefully at the logs you might miss this, or think it is a cloud coming over, rather than voltage triggered throttling. Its the same with kW and hours of solar electricity production. But, now, Goodwe have the GW5000-MS inverter, which, from what I have read, is apparently allowed in WA, for a single phase SWIS grid connection, and, that inverter is a 5kW inverter, that has a maximum panels generating capacity;
Power failure: Homes hit by solar limits as distributors protect 0000008571 00000 n
Powercor's network solutions manager Claire Cass said of 32,580 customers connected to solar with Powercor in the last 18 months, only 2023 could not export power. 0000037686 00000 n
Select your country/region. In a Enphase system, only the Envoy can provide this. just wondering if anybody can shed some light on the following, Here at SolarQuotes, we had been hearing quite a few complaints about Powercors zero export limits. hour of charging is enough to drive 35km.. JackD 1 year ago.
In writing I was advised: Exporting surplus solar power is good because it reduces fossil fuel generation and pays you a feed-in tariff that reduces electricity bills. I could easily share my excess power for the time I am not irrigating my crops. Its located in Ausnet Services' Distribution Area but Ausnet is not part of the CitiPower, Powercor and UnitedEnergy . You could contact Powercor and explain your situation, but I suspect theyll say you need to be an installer to check if an increase in export capability is available. Powercor is the Distributed Network Service Provider for central and western Victoria, as well as Melbournes western suburbs. But if you dont use much electricity it may need to be very small, as I explain here: https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/zero-kw-export-solar/. One thing I find is that Voltage control works well: instead of the inverter resetting if the voltage gets too high, my inverters roll back output, so it actually helps my neighbors too because their inverters reset less often. Origin offers 8 cents per kWh until a daily export limit of 14 kWh is reached. The whole system of domestic rooftop photovoltaic systems, needs to be reviewed; by both the legislatures and regulators, and, by the components (especially the inverters) manufacturers.
Solar system size limits explained by state | Solar Choice ), converting to up to 10kW of AC power, and, the GW5048D-ES provides for up to 6.65kW of panels generating capacity, converting to up to 4.95 kW of AC power, and, acting as a battery management system and UPS, when a battery system (of up to two approved, low voltage, batteries) is connected. Allows installation but has an export limit. Sorry Andrew: NQR. The current Envoy they will be selling is the Envoy-S. Before that was the straight Envoy which did not have the consumption monitoring / metering needed to do export limiting. But it seems the situation has been changing for the better in the last couple of months in a number of affected areas. I was told to set Power Limit to ON. So an Enphase setup, without a continuously operating Envoy with not be providing this functionality and likely to raise some concerns in the AS4777.2015 certification process if they did not take steps to make sure these functions are always guaranteed to be implemented. If you are in the solar industry - try to get to the truth, not the sale.5. Unfortunately, SAPN wont allow more than 5 kilowatts of inverter capacity on an SWER line. Seem most solar places, even the ones the go on about how good they are, arent that good when presented with this, what seems to be a conundrum for them.
Solar Export Limiting or Zero Export. What Does it Mean? AS4777.2:2015 has some rather low default recommendations, which can be tweaked up as no doubt my profile has allowed. given that we are working from home all the time these days. Perhaps it is worth mentioning that the stricter export limitation becomes, it will make a stronger argument for batteries. Regarding batteries, as we all know from our mobile phones, constantly being charged and discharged, will deteriorate much quicker than PV panels (and the same that goes for phones, laptops, and your electric toothbrush also goes for solar and electric vehicle batteries, unfortunately). Please make sure you engage early with our team through eConnect to check on network capacity for your customers. hooked up to an energy efficient 44kW motor for a real-world Nobody wants to see solar energy . A 5 kilowatt inverter will never supply more than 5 kilowatts of power no matter how many kilowatts of panels it has. March 2022 6 Powercor means Powercor Australia Limited, ABN 89 064 651 109. portal means the eConnect portal for CitiPower and . It appears the wire from the inverter is directly connected to my main fuse for the house circuits. 3. Once voltage thresholds etc are configure in the profile by the Envoy at install, each micro operates largely independently. If at any moment in time you are generating more solar electricity than you need, the excess is exported to the grid. That said, provided the Installer included your details and phone number in the customer section when the SPA was lodged, the solar team intends to follow up with customers if capacity becomes available to export into the grid through upgrades to the network.. As has been explained (and COSTED) on previous occasions batteries are VERY cost-effective.IF you stay away from the hi-tech/overpriced/dependence-creating/unproven battery-systems advocated by commercially self-interested parties. If your pumping needs are large enough this can pay for itself, but it will be expensive to set up. Just last week, Powercor (Western Victoria) advised that they now have more room in the grid for export. But still the solar companies keep trying to sell it to me.. %PDF-1.4
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There may well be a tipping point in battery prices where a drought of mid day solar will be followed by very little evening use and possibly large numbers of households abandoning the grid altogether. Any ideas of how I can get a system that is actually going to generate enough power to charge a battery? The naming of zones may differ between manufacturers but may appear as: Australia A - applies to the configuration of inverter settings in Victoria and all Eastern . 00@
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Im on a swer line in rural south Australia. 0000028638 00000 n
Export limiting generally isnt permitted. 4. Even then, the losses from the limit are minor. Im afraid thats a tough situation. IE if Im producing 8KW, the house is using 2KW it will still export 5kw? 0000037952 00000 n
No active system controls whether you use inverter of imported power. It is possible to max out the 10 kW inverter capacity with my Tesla, house load and Heat Pump hot water. xref
11kW panels with 10kW 3-phase inverter (Fronius Symo + Fronius 3-phase meter). But I can tell you a few things that might help with some of your pondering :- 1. Depending on their location, some may be constrained to a lesser export level or even no exports at all. So really apart from the requirement that the initial startup can only happy on voltages below 253v, I have no throttling until at least 285v and probably even higher. "Some of these customers may have received approval to export since, due to network improvements made since their connection." Because you dont see the rather obvious shutdowns (or see them less), you might not notice your solar might be throttled back on a regular basis. If you are interested you can read about this here: https://www.solarquotes.com.au/inverters/mppt/. Single-phase properties can install inverter capacity up to 5 kilowatts while 3 phase properties can install up to 30 kilowatts. reliable export limit control function as per AS4777.2 to limit the export output where the . Some battery powered cars can not be programmed to only recharge at particular times of the day, and, so, if someone drives one to work (that is, if and when battery powered cars become affordable to the working class) and home after work, then puts the car on the charger, the drain to the grid, that would consequently occur, during peak demand hours, needs to be covered. Households and small businesses that generate electricity using solar panels, wind turbines, or other small-scale generators, can feed back any unused electricity into the electricity grid for other customers to use.
Solar Export Limiting Explained -- What It Is & Why It's Useful If the transformer capacity is limited, you could install solar initially with a low export limit (eg 1 kW) and then have your export limit increased when the transformer was . Finally! Thanks so much, David. This seems technically impossible, because theres only a wire going from the inverter to the meter (the export or feed in to the grid) and a wire going from the meter to my homes main fuse. Or is there a build up of voltage in the system? 207 According to NT Power and Water they will normally allow up to a 5 kilowatt inverter with single phase power and up to a 7 kilowatt inverter with 3 phase power. Note that connections off the main grid are usually far more restricted. 0% After a major works program involving more than 500 different network alterations and other activities across nine key regions among the most constrained parts of the network, Powercors new solar connections export approval rate of just over 60% at the start of the year has increased to above 90%. 3. I am on my second Tesla EV and the new one has a rage of 700km if youre not a lead foot. DC Input Power (Wp) 10000, from its published datasheet. We might still be willing to do this all the same, from an environmental viewpoint. I have 3 x PV systems on one phase. I could not convince him that I knew what I was talking about! How do I get around this with SAPN , am I allowed to export limit on a swer line in Sth Aust. House batteries should have the capability of being set to turn off when they are fully charged and then on towards the middle of the day. A rooftop solar system's grid export limit is determined by the local electricity network operator - sometimes on a case-by-case basis, sometimes according to an across-the-board standard, and .
Smart inverter settings | CitiPower & Powercor This applies to both single-phase and three-phase properties. No matter how badly you may want to export limit your solar system, it can only be done in locations where its permitted. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. We installed 4.5kw with a 5kw inverter in 2014. Powercor wrote back with the following response:"Due to the size of t .
Phone, email, give us feedback or make a claim. It is critical that you install an approved smart inverter and set it correctly. If youre not satisfied with what answers our calculator gives, let me know your figures for grid electricity and solar feed-in tariff and Ill come up with an estimate for you. This gives the advantage of having a new system covered by a new set of warranties.
Some households lose 20 per cent of their solar output from grid The Ugly: In these areas export limiting may not be allowed at all. Max. Your dedicated meter will inform the inverter, and it will immediately reduce the power, so it doesnt exceed 5 kilowatts1. I cant see any reference to the NT. Then the information that was left was cut to make the piece more introductory, but perhaps all these reductions made the article like my favorite World War II movie Abridged Too Far. This could be important, given that we have a state parliamentary election due in a couple of months. It does this by adjusting the MPPT but instead of working to maximize power from the panels it reduces it. Many NSW rural situations are limited to 3Kw export, due to the length of the transmission lines. I think the installers like the Volt-watt modes, because if you dont know where to look they hid the problem at your expense anyway. 0000028229 00000 n
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Major upgrades supporting more solar exports for homes in Victoria's Whilst this may not be technically defined as export limiting, as the inverter specifications, specify that the inverter, whilst allowing up to an overload factor of 2, will only generate up to 5kW of A/C power
PDF Powercor, CitiPower & United Energy Ronald was born more years ago than he can remember. What Happens to the Surplus Power That Can't Be Exported to the Grid? I have solar on my house and having it installed at an investment property, but not sure what to do now as there will be no benefit of feed in tariff. If you can export 3kva that means you can have a solar system with up to 4 kilowatts of panels. However they have been advised that this wont be allowed anymore. I have noticed that one string seems to be performing well under the performance of the slightly smaller string. (Image from Finns Tesla App). And yes 5kW export limit applies May I suggest an extra fact check to polish the valuable story above? Thanks Ronald! This is assuming that my understanding of what I have read, is correct; that such a system would be permitted, in a single phase connection to the SWIS grid. As the LG Chem battery charges using DC current from the panels it is possible to go over the 10 kW inverter limit by charging the LG Chem battery in the middle of the day. Recent work by Victorian DNSP Powercor on some problematic parts of its network is enabling more solar power from rooftop panels to be exported to the grid. Assume positive intention.4. Some manufacturers may have this pre-selected. At the time of the powerwall install I also had the Gateway installed at an extra cost so I could keep using the generated power from the powerwall and during solar production when the powergrit fell out without danger for the grit workers because the Gateway instantly falls and prevent power to the grit. But given average voltages are probably well above what they should be in lots of places, and once you factor in your local voltage rise, and pretty low values under AS4777 etc, there is not much room to play with until the distributors get the act together and deliver us power that better matches the 230v standard they are required to deliver us. This extra meter adds to the cost of a solar system. Installers must also follow the recommendations of the inverter manufacturer and they may say the limit for panel capacity is less than one-third more than the panels capacity. South Australia Power Networks (SAPN) area: SAPN is the only distributor in South Australia. It is just the placement of the meter and the current sensor that controls the limiting. But you may as well just get a standard inverter and send your excess electricity into the grid. 0000039284 00000 n
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My guess is that when the Envoy-S sees it needs to throttle due to export limits, it does this by sending the same instruction to all micros to throttle the same amount (but dont know for sure). Select the AS/NZS 4777.2:2020 Australia A setting. In an Enphase system, that is with the Envoy-S with consumption monitoring. And for this reasons, I have increasingly seen that it is more challenging to run micros without the envoy which would no doubt be extra code required in later versions of the envoy to enforce implementation of various AS4777 and export limiting requirements that cant be done in the micros alone. We do not prevent customers from installing solar for their own self-consumption. Assume positive intention.4. As a single example, the Renault Kangoo ZE van (I think that it is the only battery powered cargo van currently available in Australia) has a 33kWh battery, and, To go further, Kangoo Z.E boasts a Z.E 33 (33kWh) battery, This is often referred to as 'network constraints'. 220 sonnenBatterie Evo. I suspect that it is likely, that that they are all signaled equally, not in truth I dont know for sure. This is because even if there is only a refrigerator running during the day it will reduce the losses from export limiting and if an effort is made to shift electricity consumption to the middle of the day then losses can be mostly or entirely eliminated.
Zero-sum game: The rise of solar export limits, and what can be done Actually I made a chart showing the percentage of electricity lines in each state that were SWER but I left it out for the sake of brevity. Real names are preferred - you should be happy to put your name to your comments.2. So, I am pretty much left in the dark about whether all the energy my panels are theoretically producing is being utilised, or (which is my fearful assumption) up to 1.6kW are wasted whenever the panels produce more than 5kW AC. But a sub optimally configured grid sometimes forces installers into implementing setting that are probably less than ideal if the high voltage events in the grid were just occasions where there is too much generation and they do want have all generators throttle back to allow some time for rebalancing supply and demand. Im glad to hear its flexible enough to do that. For example, our Solar Enablement program is intended to allow more customers to connect a 5kVa solar PV system with export capacity. There are exceptions for off-grid installations and systems that are installed with a battery. Or is the energy produced by the panels but dissipated somehow? I think it is illegal in WA to rewire your inverter or modify any parameters, as it may result in more than 5kW being sent to the grid, so I will just bite the bullet and see that I use as much solar as possible. I have a new residential PV system in Perth WA, 6.6kW total panel capacity and a 5kW inverter (Growatt Min 5000TL-X). The battery is charging from the DC current which is before the inverter. (Although they will also allow an additional 5 kilowatts of battery inverter capacity.)